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> Ancestry has gone TOO Far
Shanifaye
post Aug 29 2007, 07:11 PM
Post #1


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Group: Root Admin
From: Lilburn, GA
Surnames:
Inman, Bradley, Byers, Derreberry, Owensby and all various spellings thereof




There is a lot out there on this....so far this is the best link I've foun which covers all the bases and has links to several others bloggin on this too. I have done many searches on there and "so far" cannot find where this site has been chached....but Im sure its just a matter of time before I do, since the main page of this site is a blog and "right now" that seems to be what they are stealing

Basically it appears Ancestry has been crawling our personal genealogy sites and has now added the information to what they call an Internet Biographical Collection.

On the first day (yesterday) it was for subscribers only, it seems after the storm started they moved it to the "free" (but you have to sign up with ancestry) area.

Many people have written about this way better than I can. So go here

http://cowhampshire.blogharbor.com/blog/_a...28/3190057.html

and read up on what they are doing.

This is just wrong wrong wrong wrong

Spread the word people.......spread the word

Those of us with their own sites need to figure out what to do

Shannon
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Carol
post Aug 29 2007, 07:52 PM
Post #2


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From: Irish Hills, Michigan
Surnames:
Lashbrook
Bowen
Fenton
Trumbo




This is not the first time Ancestry has been caught with a data base with questionable beginnings.

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Linda Huff Muess...
post Aug 29 2007, 07:59 PM
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Surnames:
BAUDEWYN, BROKE, HOFF, ALLSHOUSE, ANSTATT, ANSTETT, ARIANENSE, ARIENS, BARBER, BAUGH, BECKER, BERLIN, BIGGS, BOCKER, BOWES, BOWLBY, BRACKETT, BROCK, BRODT, BROKE, BROTZMAN, BUCHI, CALL, CASE, CHARPENTIER, COLE, CORSEN, COWELL, DAVIS, DE GRAUW, DEERING, DEGRAUW, DIERDORFF, DUFOUR, EBERLEE, EVERHART, EVERLY, EVERLY, EYKER, FAIRBANKS, FAIREBANKE, FALES, FAUL, FIELD, FISKE, FITZER, HAAL, HAL, HARPER, HAUSCHILDT, HOF, HOUSHALL, HUFF, ILLYNGWORTH, JENNET, KISSELBACH, KLEIN, KOMSTAETT, KOO, KUNSMAN, LANGEN, LEYDECKER, LOW, MELROY, MERCER, MILLARD, MILLER, NACE, NEWCOMB, NEWDYKE, ODERNHEIMER, POST, POTTER, RAPALIER, RAPALJE, RAPARIELLIET, REED, ROOSE, SAUVAGIE, SCHAEFFER, SIMON, SMITH, STANCLIFFE, TEMPLETON, THATCHER, TITO, TITUS, TOWER, TRICO, TRIMMER, TRUXELL, UXAR, VAN ANGELEN, VAN KORTRYK, VAN NESS, VAN NEST, VAN NESTE, VAUTRIN, VOTRIN, VROOM, WAGNER, WAIDE, WAUTRIN, WEBER, WEITZEL, WILBER, WILLEVER, WILLIAMSON, WILSON, WILSON, WOLNOUGHE, WOTRIN, WOTRING, WOTTRING




I am a member and have not seen this to be true so far. But what do I know?
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Shanifaye
post Aug 29 2007, 08:08 PM
Post #4


Administrator
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Group: Root Admin
From: Lilburn, GA
Surnames:
Inman, Bradley, Byers, Derreberry, Owensby and all various spellings thereof




well its now 9:09 and Im still searching it, and its still giving me results
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Carol
post Aug 29 2007, 08:13 PM
Post #5


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Group: Members
From: Irish Hills, Michigan
Surnames:
Lashbrook
Bowen
Fenton
Trumbo




Linda,

It did happen, cause they sucked up my research in the process. The data base may or may not even be there any more, I know that over a number of a couple of years, the data base became corrupted from what it was in the beginnings.

The data base was reportedly, "the leftover information from DNA testing". Sure! Right! NOT!!

The family of mine that they lifted the info on, is rather small and has a very very intricate history, change of names, never formally, bigamy, confessed murder, child abandonment and a few other little juicy details. The name change along was a bear to "prove". And, it really did not get proved the way most of us researchers want to see it proved. It is a huge study of circumstantial info.

Anyway, the family is small, I did my input in a sorta unique manner, and imagine my surprise to find it word for word, puncuation for puncuation the same as my data base on this DNA leftovers data base at Ancestry.

It was clicked and claimed (that is a term of one of my dear genie friends) from the LDS Ancestral File. I called Ancestry on it, several times, I was incensed. Then I wrote a letter to LDS, to their legal department, and asked them if they gave permission for Ancestry to use the Ancestral file in this manner.

After over a year dealing with LDS, they finally came back with the real story, some dude paid his friends, or not friends, to lift the entries on the Ancestral File (not sure if they got into the IGI or not), and he paid them 10 cents per entry! They then added them to his data base, and away we went. He sold the data base to Ancestry. Anyway, LDS wiggled a lot, told me a bunch of legal beagle hogwash, and basically said, too bad, nothing we can do.

Anyway, that is my story, and I am sticking to it! ph34r.gif

This has been a number of years ago, gonna guess, about 10 years ago.

I have always felt a bit queasy about the ethics of that company since then, and yes, I still use Ancestry for my research, but I watch which data bases I use, and how. They can't do a whole lot to census images, can they??? unsure.gif

Carol
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Carol
post Aug 29 2007, 08:18 PM
Post #6


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Group: Members
From: Irish Hills, Michigan
Surnames:
Lashbrook
Bowen
Fenton
Trumbo




Shanifaye,

I was NOT on Ancestry, but went to check

I have not been able to locate the data base.

Wonder if you sign off and then back on, if you can find it??

Interesting, but, NOT funny!

Carol
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MarineGenealogy
post Aug 29 2007, 08:19 PM
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Surnames:
BENNETT, BRYANT, VARNADEE/VARNADO,
Vinson, Creech, Singleton; Reno/Reneau, Davis, Ball




Not only have they bought almost every formerly free site that I have ever tried to use in the last several months, but you can't click on ANYTHING anymore without saying it has been bought by Ancestry.com !!!

And now they are stealing other people's work[i][b] that is generously put on their OWN websites??
Ancestry dot com really has no shame and I am more and more disgusted with them.

History is not supposed to be in the hands of ONE small group of people, PARTICULARY ONES THAT USE IT FOR THEIR OWN NARROW PURPOSES!!! This is definitely dangerous, not to mention really repulsive!

Instead of (justly!) complaining to each other, I think what really needs to be done is to complain where action could possibly be taken. Companies like Ancestry will only listen when their bottom lines are hit, or they are faced with real public embarrassment.

So- let's complain to the MEDIA. I am not kidding. Genealogy is one of the fastest growing 'hobbies' in the country, and Ancestry knows it. So someone in the Media will pick up on it too if enough pissed-off people with well-worded arguments call and send them letters.

Call your local tv affiliate. Call NPR, call PBS, call your local Genealogical Society, talk about it at your Family Reunion. Hey-- do you think it's going to get BETTER??!!

We spend HOURS and YEARS on our personal Genealogy, it is precious to us. Ancestry has NO right to STEAL these from us. Be angry. You have a right to be.
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Shanifaye
post Aug 29 2007, 08:26 PM
Post #8


Administrator
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Group: Root Admin
From: Lilburn, GA
Surnames:
Inman, Bradley, Byers, Derreberry, Owensby and all various spellings thereof




Well I logged out, and I can still use my bookmark to get back in

someone else try to get to this

http://www.ancestry.com/search/db.aspx?dbid=1162&enc=1
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Pamm
post Aug 29 2007, 08:32 PM
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Thomas, Ice, Cook, Whiteman, Dunlap, Smith, Tinder, Shreve, Slaughter, Atha/Athey, Queen, Kyle, Rine, Kline, Leedy, Garber, Baldwin, Mechling, Miller, Sain, Collins, Johnson, and others




I found the site that says it is "coming soon". Here's the link from Ancestry.com.
http://www.ancestry.com/home/new.aspx
What would they have to offer if we genealogists didn't do all the research for them? Maybe we should stop uploading to Rootsweb and/or Ancestry and see what happens?
Pamm hrmph.gif
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Carol
post Aug 29 2007, 08:34 PM
Post #10


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Group: Members
From: Irish Hills, Michigan
Surnames:
Lashbrook
Bowen
Fenton
Trumbo




Shanifaye,

I did:

came up as UNKNOWN for data base, but had the description still on line.

when I did a search on one of my surnames, got this:

"We're sorry but search. is temporarily unavailable. We are undergoing routine maintenance or we may be experiencing unexpected technical problems. We apologize for the inconvenience and ask for your patience as we work to correct the situation. Check back with us shortly."

OKKK, tried again, with a different surname (it is supposed to search surnames, right??)

Anyway, came up with a different error message.

Gotta crash on outta here now, cannot stick around for any more fun, have major problems here at the house, and the work load has me worn out totally.

Thanks for the heads up on this, I will use it as an example in a class sometime.

Keep us posted, eh??

Carol
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Shanifaye
post Aug 29 2007, 08:37 PM
Post #11


Administrator
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Group: Root Admin
From: Lilburn, GA
Surnames:
Inman, Bradley, Byers, Derreberry, Owensby and all various spellings thereof




aha progress....the search still gives results but if you click on view record it wont take you anywhere

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margaretann
post Aug 29 2007, 08:45 PM
Post #12


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Group: Members
From: Tennessee
Surnames:
James; Tull; Woods, McIntire; McIntyre; Cox, Day; Johnson; Rogers; Morton; Huggins;Cooper; Ruff; Cooksey; Randolph; Poe, Brown; McMillian; Taylor; Myers; Neff; Pennywitt; Will; Sherman; Scherman...; Longernecker; Harpine; Coffman; Kauffman...; Horn; Stiles; Styles; Riddle; Ruddel; Ruddle; Bowman; Hite; Meredith, Walker, Scott, Spence, Hall, Davis, Edge, Pugh, Quick, Dandridge, Giles- all I can think of off the top of my head- will add more later.




Okay, I went to ancestry and initially couldn't find this database listed in the
normal new database postings, but when I checked the card catalogue -
it was right there and I did a quick search for several surnames and places
I commonly search and sure enough they appear to have scarfed up about
half of the internet (well, maybe not half).

At the very least this is one of the most unethical things I have seen in the
genealogical community. I have subscribed to ancestry.com for years. I
absolutely love the census records, WWI records and several other databases
I use on a regular basis, but as soon as footnote.com or World Vital Records
or someone else gets these records posted and their indexing worked
out I will drop my ancestry.com script- although I will miss it very very much.

I posted my own displeasure with ancestry.com today on their 24hour blog and I
hope the rest of the genealogy community will do the same- appears they are
and that ancestry may just may be getting it. whistling.gif

I apologize I startled everyone on this fantastic list this afternoon with my
ancestry question. I will not let ancestry change my habits of posting queries and
data to websites I use. That is probably what they want to do so they can
monopolize internet genealogy. I will not quit sharing or seeking information. I
will continue to use their databases, but I will also be searching for other paid
subscription sites that offer quality records and documents that meet my research
needs.

Okay, Okay, I will stop unsure.gif
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Shanifaye
post Aug 29 2007, 08:48 PM
Post #13


Administrator
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Group: Root Admin
From: Lilburn, GA
Surnames:
Inman, Bradley, Byers, Derreberry, Owensby and all various spellings thereof




no no Im very glad you did, I've been so busy at work catching up from vacation I havent been visiting any blogs this week, so I hadnt heard it...and it hadnt been mentioned on any of the mailing lists I subscribe to (prob cause the list nazi's deemed it "off topic")

I take back what I previously posted, it IS still giving results and its allowing you to see the record...maybe by tomorrow they will have actually deleted like they are saying they did
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rwelgin1
post Aug 29 2007, 09:03 PM
Post #14


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Group: Members
From: Memphis, TN
Surnames:
Boumal, Castleman/Casselman, Elgin/Elgen/Ilgen, Foglesong, Gosnell, Howard, Lowers, Machiels, Prantil, Stratton, Stoner/Steiner, and Sebastiani.




so, Ancestry got caught with there data "around their ankles" sort of saying?
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Shanifaye
post Aug 29 2007, 09:05 PM
Post #15


Administrator
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Group: Root Admin
From: Lilburn, GA
Surnames:
Inman, Bradley, Byers, Derreberry, Owensby and all various spellings thereof




oh thats a good one hehehehe crazy.gif
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rwelgin1
post Aug 29 2007, 09:23 PM
Post #16


Member
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Group: Members
From: Memphis, TN
Surnames:
Boumal, Castleman/Casselman, Elgin/Elgen/Ilgen, Foglesong, Gosnell, Howard, Lowers, Machiels, Prantil, Stratton, Stoner/Steiner, and Sebastiani.




Another post on this, sorry.
I looked on Ancestry.com and noticed that they claimed to have added 14 million names this week. I find it funny that ONLY one of my family lines have been traced.
You would think that I would come across more then 1 of my lines having had been done.
The only line that I can truely say that I have found ANYONE doing research on is my Castleman line. Now, with as big of a family as my HOWARD line is, you would think that I could find tons of information, no, to the contrary.
I don't know how we can tell if Ancestry.com is actually going into personal information and retrieiving it, but if so, there are 2 things that you can do. You can create your own "patent" on your family tree. Instead of posting it for Ancestry or rootsweb or whomever to assume rights to it, if you place a disclaimer on the rights to your family tree, no one has the right to sell it without your consent. Once you post it to a website, you have lost your rights to that info if they have a disclaimer on it.
Next, I was going to metion that on Ancestry.com, I noticed that there were a few big companies that were going to focus on Ancestry. If you made these comapnies aware of just how Ancestry gets thier information, that would be a huge embarassment to Ancestry, if there is a way to prove this claim.

If everyone was to stop paying into companies such as Ancestry, they would have no altrnative then to listen to their customers. Personally, I find it hard to accept a company that wants to charge a huge price for information that they most likely were given for free.




Latest Genealogy Tools Create a Need to Know
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Discover Your Family's Past With Today's Technology
Good Morning America’s technology contributor Becky Worley shows how Ancestry.com helps families trace their ancestry and document their family history.


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Ancestry.com announces an exciting partnership with Sorenson Genomics which will add DNA results to its ever-expanding database of family history records.


Building a Family Tree Using an Upgraded Site Online
Walter Mossberg reviews the new family tree building features on Ancestry.com.
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Sandra Staley
post Aug 30 2007, 05:39 AM
Post #17


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Group: Members
Surnames:
STALEY, Platt, Cooke, Watts, Cherry, Bradshaw, Trench, Kinnett, Hill, Lawrence, Stratton, Richards, Leigh, King, Box, Cleete, Warden, Rixon, Bone, Bromhead, Gilling, Green, Baker, Sparham, Dixey, Jones, Newman, Gleed, Grimes, Stoneham, Hill, Bance, Pratt, Bottomley, Hunnerley, Slatcher, Bostock, Palmer, White, Kirby, Beeton, Killingworth, Bland, Gray, Parker, Landril, Shrive, Cox, Methuen, Foot, Hinds, Groom, Smith, Ruggles, Scott, Elborough, Jeffery, Phillimore, Brooks, Preston, Chapman, Salter, Gore.




Welcome to the real world! The smash-and-grab raiders pirate.gif have been around for a long, long time.

I’ve been living with pirate.gifs for so long that I'm getting my own research, thinly disguised as the correspondent’s own work, sent back to me third or fourth hand for verification and/or inclusion in my databases! This is why I always acknowledge the source of the information I’ve used.

For years I’ve been gathering information from the internet, the fruit of other people’s research, and including it in my databases. It quite simply never occurred to me that there was anything wrong in this – it was freely available.

Ancestry’s real crime is that they’ve got greedy and have been spotted. To add insult to injury, they are apparently making money out of fencing stolen property, in a manner of speaking.

But are they? If they’ve gathered information from the internet, it is in the public domain and consequently not stolen. The information is freely available.

So what are the options:

• Spout outraged anger, bang keyboards, etc – what does that achieve?

• Remove the information from the internet – and lose possible contacts?

• Take the big boys on – how many little guys win this sort of fight?

OR

• Get sneaky by editing databases so that all that’s seen online are the barebones of families. Save the good stuff, the detail that makes it interesting, for those possible relatives that have the courtesy to make direct contact.

To summarise: Never ever put online anything you don’t want spread around.


Sandra

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Shanifaye
post Aug 30 2007, 06:07 AM
Post #18


Administrator
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Group: Root Admin
From: Lilburn, GA
Surnames:
Inman, Bradley, Byers, Derreberry, Owensby and all various spellings thereof




well my initial outrage is that they had it set up for pay subscribers only and sourced it as their own information and they had the information stored on their server so that when you clicked to view the cached page it came up with an Ancestry URL. Then when they got wind of peoples displeasure they made it a free database and made the "view live link" more visible. I have had a hard fast rule that I will not contribute information to any site that makes you pay to see stuff.

People keep bringing up that we dont care about google, archive.org etc but what they dont seem to understand is that google is completely different...they dont make you pay to see search results and it links straight to your own site.


As of this posting, the database is still there and still searchable and records are still viewable, though it does NOT show up in the database

I find it amusing though that the didnt check their crawling too well as search results have resulted in giving you porn sites laugh.gif
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autumndivona
post Aug 30 2007, 07:21 AM
Post #19


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From: Beck Row, Suffolk, England
Surnames:
Wood, Haley, Shaw, Bartlett, Galfre; husband's Hawksley, Goodwin and Workman families.




I've never been a fan of Ancestry.com. I feel they charge far too much money simply for offering the convenience of at-home research. We could get ALL the items they offer at libraries, town halls, and the FHL. Plus, we could get friendly, one-on-one service from the employees and volunteers at these places.

Of course, it is not always convenient, particularly if the information you seek is in another state OR you have to wait about 4 weeks for the FHL to receive microfilms. (I'm old-fashioned, so I don't mind waiting for microfilms to come to my local FHL, or SASEs to come back to my home.)

There is very little competition in this area of internet research, and it is really a pity that Ancestry operates in such a manner. This is why I adore the free pages of the USGenWeb and other sites available. OF COURSE, Rootsweb is run by Ancestry's parent family anyway (grrrr)...

It is time for the smaller, free sites to break free of Ancestry, kick the advertising banner OFF their pages, and say "We don't need you!"

That would be a start, I think.
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Shanifaye
post Aug 30 2007, 07:47 AM
Post #20


Administrator
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Group: Root Admin
From: Lilburn, GA
Surnames:
Inman, Bradley, Byers, Derreberry, Owensby and all various spellings thereof




Thats the entire reason I started AC.....free, no having to look at stupid ads, NO affiliation with ancestry...and a nice friendly board mistress to help provide one on one (or two or three or four) service

I just wish more people would actually take advantage of the research skills we have here
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